As OAV 4 approaches, have people gotten over OAV3? Or is there still butthurt?

[bishopcruz]

Hey all. So yeah, the title. I apparently missed the news about Tenchi OAV4, and actually found out about it when I was watching the Anime Abandon episode on Tenchi Muyo OAV a couple of weeks ago. It kinda blew my mind just how bad Bennett's information was. It was like he was watching a completely different series, calling out nonexistent plot holes, not understanding basic plot points (he was surprised that Washuu was a goddess and thought Sasami died for example) and spared no effort in completely lambasting the third OAV. Looking around, I found a podcast on the series, the Tenchicast, and I couldn't finish it it was so insufferable, though that one was a few years ago.

I had kinda hoped years ago, that over time, people would at least try to accept the OAVs for what they are and not what they wanted them to be. Are these isolated incidents, or is the fandom still split over the whole affair. Last time I was around here, I remember that there was a huge dislike between here and the Tenchiforum, has time healed the wounds a bit, or are we still at war so to speak?

It's also kind of a shame that there is no podcast or video defending OAV3, there are a few ripping it apart, but nothing explaining it, and helping people understand why it is what it is.

[Harls]

I had kinda hoped years ago, that over time, people would at least try to accept the OAVs for what they are and not what they wanted them to be. Are these isolated incidents, or is the fandom still split over the whole affair. Last time I was around here, I remember that there was a huge dislike between here and the Tenchiforum, has time healed the wounds a bit, or are we still at war so to speak?

I think "war" is the wrong term.
The failure of Ai to lure in new fans or spark interest from AIC to continue in non-OVA continuities damped any fire in the leadership's interest in Tenchi Muyo!, and the release of "IF" and announcement of Kajishima's continuing story direction has doused it completely, as they see a narrative dead-end.

Not that they don't love Universe. The nostalgia goggles are strapped on pretty tight.

[Dr.Soviet]

I had kinda hoped years ago, that over time, people would at least try to accept the OAVs for what they are and not what they wanted them to be. Are these isolated incidents, or is the fandom still split over the whole affair. Last time I was around here,

Regarding what people think of the OAVs the Japanese have accepted them for what they are and moved on and are quite excited for OAV 4, what people think in the states is merely opinion and has no effect on what content we get in the future. As far as the question of people being split over OAV 3 here I really don't know, I would hope that people have moved on from something that happened over 10 years ago.

I remember that there was a huge dislike between here and the Tenchiforum, has time healed the wounds a bit, or are we still at war so to speak?

Not sure I haven't spoken to anyone over there, I won't go in to details of what happen since its just smearing but its hard to say if we could ever work together as nice as that would be .

[Marty Kirra]

Well if people don't like something, they're not going to like it more as time passes just because it's older. I think OAV3 was a huge misstep along with the -If- shenanigans. I cautiously await OAV4, but I don't have high hopes. Doesn't make me any less of a fan!

[antvasima]

Well, there are some people who still go on and on about how much they hate the 3rd OVA, as soon as any news about Tenchi Muyo are mentioned.

Personally I am looking forward to the new series, hope that there will be a 5th OVA, and will buy the Blu-Ray collections when they come out.

However, I am still sad about that Mihoshi's voice actress died.

[Guy183]

I really enjoyed it.

Anyway, sadly no, the flame still burning.

[GP cadet 87]

I would just like to mention something about Bennett the Sage. I think he's a good reviewer, but he didn't have access to any of the background material for TM. So of course the 3rd OVA will be confusing for him.

I don't hate the 3rd OVA. As I said before, I think most fans were upset because, instead of learning more about Jurain society or have Tenchi become more forward with the girls; a lot of the episodes' screen time felt like fluff.  For example, we learn about Mihoshi's brother and his relationship with his subordinate. I didn't care about that. We learn Tenchi has an older sister; it doesn't matter to the plot or the dynamic of the cast, so why bother introducing her?

I wanted more of the main characters, I wanted to see stuff happening with them. A lot of the plot felt rushed. Some of the humor worked well, but I din't like the fact that. It didn't help matters that Noike, a new character who was basically filled Kiyone's role from the Universe continuity. pushed Ryoko and Ayeka to the background.

The first two OVAs had a good balance of slice-of-life and space opera tropes. The 3rd OVA was just too much of the former IMO.

Hopefully we have a lot more world-building and character development.

[takahata]

There were many problems with OVA 3.  The series did introduce Mihoshi's brother Misao and her father Nakita.  Nakita was the general who was talking about the Chobomaru  with Mihoshi's own grandfather the Marshall.  OVA 3 miss the chance to introduce fully Mihoshi's own family.  I am very curious about learning who are Mihoshi's paternal grandparents.  Nakita had decided to accept the Kuramitsu surname.

The Kuramitsu Family is one of the two most powerful families in the Seniwan Empire.  The second most powerful family in the Seniwan Empire is the Royal Family. Both the Kuramitsu Family and the Royal Family do seem to share power and influence.  The Royal family is a candidate for Nakita's family. If Nakita turns out to be a member of the Royal Family, Mihoshi will be a princess, even thru Nakita decided to become a member of the Kuramitsu family.

OVA 3 did explain what was going on.  It didn't explain clearly about what the Chousin Sisters were doing.  Even worst,  the death of Tenchi's mother was treated as a bad joke.  Tenchi's mother did overdone it with her final gift to her son.

One of the reasons why I want to see OVA 4 as a sequel to Ryo-Ohki is because I do feel that episode 20 was the last episode of the Tenchi Muyo: Ryo-Ohki series.  As a sequel, OVA 4 will be a different series.

OVA 3 turn out to be a good series.  It had its share of problems.  The disclosure of the Chousin Sister's search for the powerful Kami help to save OVA 3 from being a medicore series.  When it comes to OVA 4,  I have come to expect one thing to happen. The only thing is Sasami going to school.  Like I have stated before in another reply, Sasami's primary reason for going to school is for social reasons. If Sasami is going to school in OVA 4,  she will need a best friend.  The best name for Sasami's best friend can be Misao Amane.

[جبريل 無道]

has time healed the wounds a bit, or are we still at war so to speak?

There is no war here, from our side, because it's understood that anime is just entertainment.  We like what we like what we like, without having to defend it or shit on the other thing at every turn years later.  We like scanning and finding old art and releasing it for others to enjoy, even if the exact product it originates from isn't our thing.  I don't even like OAV3 all that much, but I'm happy for other people who do.  I'm even happy for people who liked Ai.

The splitting of the fandoms has been a complete blessing because it was a forced and unhappy and bickering marriage the entire time it was together back in the 00s, and got as boring as a religious war with each side arguing One True Path™.  Sometimes people don't get along and that's okay, the internet is big enough.  The two major sides are essentially fans of completely different products and sets of characters that share some similiarities but aren't the exact same, especially perceived future endings, so let's leave it that way.

[bishopcruz]

has time healed the wounds a bit, or are we still at war so to speak?

There is no war here, from our side, because it's understood that anime is just entertainment.  We like what we like what we like, without having to defend it or shit on the other thing at every turn years later.  We like scanning and finding old art and releasing it for others to enjoy, even if the exact product it originates from isn't our thing.  I don't even like OAV3 all that much, but I'm happy for other people who do.  I'm even happy for people who liked Ai.

The splitting of the fandoms has been a complete blessing because it was a forced and unhappy and bickering marriage the entire time it was together back in the 00s, and got as boring as a religious war with each side arguing One True Path™.  Sometimes people don't get along and that's okay, the internet is big enough.  The two major sides are essentially fans of completely different products and sets of characters that share some similiarities but aren't the exact same, especially perceived future endings, so let's leave it that way.

I suppose, but back in the days of the TenchiML, in the before time, in the long long ago, it seemed like most fans liked both the OAVs and the TV series, and were united in their hatred of Tenchi in Tokyo. The biggest flame wars were about whether or not your particular girl was going to be the OTP. You could have a preference for one or the other, but it wasn't like the vitriol that came out after the 3rd series.


OAV 3 definitely has its issues. No doubt. It's my least favorite of the 3 for sure, with the  first series being pretty much the best by a wide margin.  I tend to think its flaws are more related to execution than actual story, for example you could have probably condensed the chobimaru stuff into one episode, and the flashbacks in episode 1 were wasted time. What did did do well though was expand the world, and answer the question of what Tenchi was.

I would just like to mention something about Bennett the Sage. I think he's a good reviewer, but he didn't have access to any of the background material for TM. So of course the 3rd OVA will be confusing for him.

I don't hate the 3rd OVA. As I said before, I think most fans were upset because, instead of learning more about Jurain society or have Tenchi become more forward with the girls; a lot of the episodes' screen time felt like fluff.  For example, we learn about Mihoshi's brother and his relationship with his subordinate. I didn't care about that. We learn Tenchi has an older sister; it doesn't matter to the plot or the dynamic of the cast, so why bother introducing her?

I wanted more of the main characters, I wanted to see stuff happening with them. A lot of the plot felt rushed. Some of the humor worked well, but I din't like the fact that. It didn't help matters that Noike, a new character who was basically filled Kiyone's role from the Universe continuity. pushed Ryoko and Ayeka to the background.

The first two OVAs had a good balance of slice-of-life and space opera tropes. The 3rd OVA was just too much of the former IMO.

Hopefully we have a lot more world-building and character development.

The thing is, I think the OAV was hurt by being released 10 years after the previous ones. Not to mention being tied to GXP, and expecting you to know characters from that series as well. Noike didn't bother me, primarily because she actually brings more to the table than Kiyone did. Kiyone, as per her appearances, was essentially a foil for Mihoshi and not much else. She filled the role of the normal character, and had a pretty dope character design. I like her and all, but I do feel her importance is kinda overstated. Not to mention her presence Flanderizes Mihoshi. But if you loved her, I get why not having her around might irk you.

But I digress... I guess I understand not liking the third OAV, I just tend to hate rants that don't even critique it on its own terms, or show an active misunderstanding of the series. Bennett's review had a LOT of that. To be fair it didn't help that he was watching the Dub, something that pretty much destroyed a lot of the nuance in the dialogue and got a lot of things wrong, but he really did mess up on some major points. Even stuff that was literally explained in the episodes itself. For example, I do NOT get how anyone could think Sasami died after watching the Sasami and Tsunami episode, it flat out says she didn't, that is the whole point of the episode. Or not understanding that Washuu was a goddess, it is right there on the screen in OAV2.

I guess it just bums me out that so many people are shitting on the 4th OAV before it even comes out. And don't get me started on the apparent dislike of Geminar, that show is Kajishima's best put together project by far.

[جبريل 無道]

I suppose, but back in the days of the TenchiML, in the before time, in the long long ago, it seemed like most fans liked both the OAVs and the TV series, and were united in their hatred of Tenchi in Tokyo. The biggest flame wars were about whether or not your particular girl was going to be the OTP. You could have a preference for one or the other, but it wasn't like the vitriol that came out after the 3rd series.

Well right there you hit upon it.  The majority of the absolute vitriol stems less from what occurred in OAV3 itself and more from the slow realization that MK is fully pro-harem and won't fulfill a singular pairing, of mainly a very loud and persistent OTP crowd.

It's no coincidence that the same crowd that spent years absolutely shitting upon OAV3 for not including Kiyone Makibi... pretty much said next-to-nothing about AiTM not including her AFAIK, although her inclusion would make much more sense in a Negishi continuity.  It's also why OAV2 was considered perfectly great by most until they started hating anything Kajishima, then suddenly some considered it crappy after-the-fact.  It's rationalization.

The harem issue caused the split.

[BlackAeronaut]

I find it interesting that the anti-harem sentiments somewhat mirror the direction politics in the USA are taking.

On one side, you have pushes for acceptance and rights for LGBT and even a startling ruling on bigamy (which was later reversed on a technicality).

On the other side...  well, bigotry, ignorance, and the dreams of a lost glory that won't return.

Funny how politics mirrors the fanbase, huh?

[Harls]

I suppose, but back in the days of the TenchiML, in the before time, in the long long ago, it seemed like most fans liked both the OAVs and the TV series, and were united in their hatred of Tenchi in Tokyo. The biggest flame wars were about whether or not your particular girl was going to be the OTP. You could have a preference for one or the other, but it wasn't like the vitriol that came out after the 3rd series.

I'm willing to point at the younger Toonami generation for misunderstanding and nostalgia glasses.

[AstroNerdBoy]

I'll add my 2¢, and this is purely anecdotal information. When OVA 3 came out from FUNimation, my FAQ site immediately rose up in traffic. What I learned is that all of the people e-mailing me to ask me questions (and there were lots back then) were new fans to the franchise who'd been introduced to Tenchi via OVA 3. Because we'd already seen the split in older fans because of OVA 3, I was curious to see what these fans thought about OVA 3 (if they didn't specifically mention something in their e-mails), and without exception, all of them loved OVA 3 and were looking forward to watching OVA 1 and 2 (if they hadn't already gone out and watched it).

Now, as I said, this is just anecdotal evidence, but I do believe that folks with no emotional ties to the original OVA series going back to the TenchiML (Heh! I used to be a part of that!) and AIC's English forum (and other such forums) had no problems with OVA 3. Of the old school fans, the fans who were versed in the additional, canon information that came from Kajishima-sensei during the years between OVA 2 and OVA 3 (and who'd watched GXP) liked OVA 3, even if they found flaws in it. The other old school fans who weren't that versed and didn't care to become versed seemed to be the ones who hated OVA 3 the most, more so if they had vested theories that didn't pan out.

I've defended OVA 3 for years while admitting it is flawed (and I will ALWAYS hate how the battle between Tenchi's harem and the GXP Special Forces was handled) and I was hammered for YEARS by this all over the Internet. In more recent times, that has all but stopped (though I know I'm still "watched"), but yeah, I know how insane the butthurt and rage some folks have over OVA 3.

[Warmaster]

Well I only watched OVA3 about a month or two ago and it was pretty much straight after OVA1+2. I bet a lot of people had nostalgia goggles on back then, twelve years is quite a long time. My problems with OVA3 were just down to poor pacing and I thought the tone was somewhat different from the first two OVA's. Other than that though I just accepted this was where the story was going and that if it didn't make sense to me I should read the background material. I will say though, I hope OVA4 is not like OVA3.

I think they need to decide on a design for Ryoko's ears also, they're mighty morphing.